Why Should Atheists Care About Other People?

Atheists are often portrayed as people who don’t/shouldn’t have reason to care about others – that atheism leads to selfishness. The line of thinking goes something like:

  • we don’t believe humans have a soul, therefore
  • we think this life is all there is – there is no afterlife, therefore
  • we think that there is no reward (eternal heaven) or punishment (hell) awaiting us after we die, therefore
  • we have no motivation to be good people – we have no good reason to be good and will act in only self-serving ways.

Some might be surprised to learn that I, and many of my atheist brothers and sisters, care more about treating people with care and respect now than we did before becoming atheists. Why? Well, because:

  • we don’t think humans have a soul, therefore
  • we don’t think there is an afterlife, therefore
  • we think this life is all any of us get, and
  • we want this life to be as happy and fulfilling as possible, and
  • we think every human deserves to have what we have.

Those last three bullets are all about having a heightened sense of empathy around human desires to avoid suffering and be happy.

But what underlies this empathy for another’s happiness? Although I can’t speak for all atheists, I’ve read enough blog posts, comments and forum threads to have seen a consistent answer from many of us, and I’m guessing it boils down to this line of reasoning:

  • we share a sense of wonder and awe that our 14 billion year old universe and 4.5 billion year old earth yielded life
  • because of this multi-billion year heritage, we also share a deep-seated feeling of interconnectedness – via shared ancestry – with all of earth’s living creatures
  • we have an intense appreciation for the struggle to survive among every human – past and present – along with the notion that we are all related
  • we are exquisitely grateful for the good fortune of being part of the chain of life
  • we share a sense of kinship, care and respect for others within that chain

Evolutionary biologists often theorize that caring and morality are evolved, built-in characteristics of human beings (I’d guess they are right). That’s one way of explaining how we came to care. What I’ve tried to do above is slightly different – I’ve attempted to put a more personal face on why we might care.

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April 21, 2009 · Filed Under Atheism

Comments

38 Responses to “Why Should Atheists Care About Other People?”

  1. Runner Susan on April 21st, 2009 at 10:51 am

    totally agree on that care more part. totally.

  2. Paul on April 21st, 2009 at 12:18 pm

    Nice post.

  3. Brian on April 21st, 2009 at 5:59 pm

    Nice post!

    It’s a good thing for Christians especially that morality is an innate, ‘evolved’ characteristic of humans.  I would hate to see a Christian that got his morality from the bible (they might ‘think’ they do).  Could you imagine their screwy parenting skills if they did??  (Leviticus 20:9 or Exodus 21:15-17).

    Rob
    August 8th, 2010 at 9:34 pm

    Hi Brian – It is great that you have so much concern for God’s people and Jewish laws. Jesus gave a new covenant that we can all be a part of. He showed mercy and love for all people and was killed by the Romans on behalf of the Jews for what he was teaching. It is through his death and rising to life that we also have eternal life.

    Did you know the USA still has the death penalty. What are you doing about that? Don’t blame God.

  4. 40 Year Old Atheist on April 21st, 2009 at 9:37 pm

    Brain, I always enjoy your comments. :)

  5. K. Patrick Glover on May 3rd, 2009 at 1:00 pm

    I think we also share a belief in the innate nobility of the human spirit and a feeling of injustice that religion tries to take the credit for that nobility away from us and bestow it upon some fairy tale creator.

    Rob
    August 8th, 2010 at 9:23 pm

    Hi – Is there a common atheist view? Religion is not the issue but God is. The facts are: either God exists or He doesn’t. This is something everyone has to make an answer to. If you have fine. If you haven’t then find out more.

    It is a really important issue. It is a life and death issue for us all. Thanks Patrick.

  6. Matthew on May 8th, 2009 at 7:45 am

    Really good post!

  7. Rene on May 12th, 2009 at 10:49 pm

    exactly! It’s good to hear people saying these things.

    I think we need to place emphasis on the positive aspects of atheism and not spend too much time on the very easy task of attacking faith.

    btw great looking sites.

    Rob
    August 8th, 2010 at 9:35 pm

    Can you enlighten me on the positive aspects of atheism please?

  8. Bob on May 14th, 2009 at 3:56 pm

    You must repent and accept Jesus or face Hellfire when you die.

    Rob
    August 8th, 2010 at 9:41 pm

    Hi – I am not sure this is helpful. I know that everyone has to either accept or deny Jesus but he did come to show love and mercy to everyone.

    It would be best if everyone read both “Origin of the Species” by Darwin and the Bible starting at Mark in the New Testament, then Romans.

    Go to the source documents which are available. Much better than arguing about what others say.

  9. 40 Year Old Atheist on May 14th, 2009 at 3:59 pm

    Thanks for the unsubstantiated threat, Bob. You may want to do a little more reading.

  10. Bob on May 15th, 2009 at 12:32 pm

    This “threat” is not a threat but a warning of the need to be saved from your sins.

  11. 40 Year Old Atheist on May 15th, 2009 at 12:37 pm

    Bob, I don’t respond to fear-based threats or warnings or whatever you want to call it. There is no evidence for your belief in hell. Go prey on the weak minded.

    Rob
    August 8th, 2010 at 9:42 pm

    Hi – What strengths are there in atheism? I would like to know.

  12. MJ on May 15th, 2009 at 2:13 pm

    Thanks for the posts.  I’m always happy to read them because they offer huge insight for me – both from your posts and other’s comments. 

    I did have something I’m curious about.  Why the need to disavow a soul?  Is it the whole Judeo-Christian-Muslim thing of having a need to save your soul?  Why couldn’t the soul arise out of a biological mechanism that gave rise to the cerebrum?  Could it be an accident that gave us a lot of benefits but is in no way tied to God or belief in God?  Couild it be like the evolution of the opposable thumb, something that gave humans a competitive advantage over other species that are bigger, faster and stronger? 

    Could it be that the soul arises and gives us yet another competitive advantage?  Could it be that the soul will help us to stop ourselves before we destroy ourselves whereas another species without that quality might rush headofrth to it’s destruction using it’s competitive advantage without a view to the future impacts.  Could it be an adaptation like any othr adaptation?

    Anyways, just some food for thought.

    Rob
    August 8th, 2010 at 9:50 pm

    Good question. It isn’t whether we have need for a soul. We were created in God’s image and are different from other animals that rely on instinct. We can think beyond this and reason. We can decide what to believe in, which is great.

    I suggest to everyone to use their reasoning. We can’t see the wind but we know it is there. I also believe that in everyone’s life God will talk to you. But you have to be prepared to listen.

    Don’t close your mind but make an informed decision. Then of course don’t keep it open so you go with the wind and believe anything anyone says. Use your power to reason, which is your soul. Read Mark and Romans in the Bible.

  13. 40 Year Old Atheist on May 15th, 2009 at 2:18 pm

    Hi MJ,

    Thanks for commenting. My viewpoing comes from lack of evidence. There is as little evidence for a soul as there is for god. Could there be a soul? Could it serve the purpose and advantage you suggest? Sure, but there is currently no evidence for it existing or serving that purpose. Therefore, I am going by what there is evidence for – that I am living this reality in this materialistic world.

    What we have is intelligence (the part that will hopefully keep us from destroying ourselves) and consciousness. Does that consciousness continue after life? I don’t know but, until I see evidence that it does, I maintain my skepticism.

    Thanks!

  14. MJ on May 15th, 2009 at 2:21 pm

    Oh by the way Bob, there are many other religions out there – all caliming that non-believers will go to hell or not be allowed in to “heaven”.  Really, you might have bet on the wrong horse … imagine that future …. <cue ominous music> ;o)

  15. 40 Year Old Atheist on May 15th, 2009 at 2:47 pm

    MJ, enter Pascal’s Wager redux!

  16. MJ on May 15th, 2009 at 2:55 pm

    Good response.  Thanks!  I’d agree with calling it consciousness.  For me the word soul has the same connotation … mainly I think because I wasn’t raised in the Christian tradition.  And I never took Christianity really seriously – I mean any God that would say Mahatma Gandhi goes to hell because he never converted but  Jeffrey Dahmer, because he repented at the last minute, gets in isn’t a God I ever want to be in the presence of or have a belief in.

    Me I’m kind of an undecided – in the tradition of the null hypothesis – it makes no difference to the way I operate whether there is or isn’t a God.  I live by my conscience … and yes my conscience does allow me to tease people like Bob. :o )

    Rob
    August 8th, 2010 at 9:54 pm

    Interesting that you can think for God. The important issue for Christians is the relationship we have with God. It isn’t a matter of whether you do good works. It is a matter of knowing him and wanting to be with him for eternity. Everyone makes this decision. Hell is just a place without God. Heaven is where God is. You decide which is better!

    Read Mark and Romans in the Bible.

  17. DDD on July 19th, 2009 at 8:20 pm

    So, what if you’re wrong about atheism? Seems like a pretty big bet…

  18. 40 Year Old Atheist on July 19th, 2009 at 8:28 pm

    @ DDD: What if YOU are wrong? I assume you are Christian – what if you are wrong and the Muslims have it right? What if Hinduism turns out to be right?
    Also, if by logic, I am convinced there is no god but I pretend to believe in god just to ‘hedge my bets’, do you not think that god would know? In that case, wouldn’t a god think honesty is better than just putting on the face that is required?
    You need to google Pascal’s Wager. Your bet is severely inadequate it it’s logic.
    Thanks for your comment, though.

  19. DDD on July 20th, 2009 at 10:15 pm

     Thanks for the info on Pascal’s Wager.
      I’m not really trying to use logic to get to my answer because I’m pretty sure that one can’t logically prove God – or at least, I’m not “logically inclined” enough to make it stick in this forum!
      (On a side note: Can you logically prove that there is no God? I would bet that it’s hard or impossible – depending on your belief, of course – to do that also.)
     I was struck by your comments about care and respect at the top of the page here. Quite frankly, I had always thought of atheists as very self-centered people – probably because that’s the impression I have of the few atheists I know – and these folks didn’t really seem to care and respect others all that much, even though they might have gotten along very well with me.
      My point might be this: caring and respect indicate to me that you might actually have some humility, that you have a desire to move things forward. I’m sure you love your children. You say you’re grateful (to who?). You might even have hope.
    If this is all there is, why hope?
      I’m not betting anything, and I wouldn’t encourage you to do so either. You can’t just act like God exists or bet in that direction – you have to actually commit.
      I’m no expert on all the religions in the world. I don’t know all the pros and cons of each. I’ve been around Muslims, Hindus, Christians, atheists, and just plain lazy people that don’t really seem to have a belief in anything that requires more that a few random positive thoughts. In almost all cases, I’d say that some of them are very good friends – but they’re not all “right” in their beliefs. At least one of us must be wrong, which kind of leads us back to Pascal’s Wager, I think.
      Anyways, can you tell me why the awesome order that surrounds us is NOT evidence FOR God?
      And aren’t your arguments against a big “g” God that exists, not the piddly little “g” god that’s a fake? Are you only making it worse for yourself by referring to “god” if God exists?

    40 Year Old Atheist
    August 4th, 2009 at 10:57 pm

    @DDD

    Thanks for the info on Pascal’s Wager.

    My pleasure. Thanks for taking the time to read up on it.

    On a side note: Can you logically prove that there is no God? I would bet that it’s hard or impossible – depending on your belief, of course – to do that also.

    I think you’ll find that most atheists would have similar responses to this challenge. 1) I never claim to have *proof* of the non-existence of god. What I do claim is that there is no evidence in support of his existence. 2) The onus of proof is on the person making the claim. If you claim there is a god or UFOs or the Tooth Fairy, you are the one who must support that claim – not I. 3) I can’t prove God’s non-existence just like I can’t prove the non-existence of a million other things we can imagine in our minds (you may want to google ‘Russel’s Teapot’ for this one).

    I was struck by your comments about care and respect at the top of the page here. Quite frankly, I had always thought of atheists as very self-centered people – probably because that’s the impression I have of the few atheists I know – and these folks didn’t really seem to care and respect others all that much, even though they might have gotten along very well with me.

    There are jerk atheists and nice atheists just like there are jerk Christians and nice Christians. Thanks for the compliment. You seem very nice and thoughtful also. I appreciate the tone of your entire comment – inquisitive and not condescending.

    You say you’re grateful (to who?). You might even have hope.
    If this is all there is, why hope?

    One of the very interesting things about us humans is that we want to put a human face on things. Why do I need to be grateful to a ‘who’? Why can I not be grateful for *being* – for being so fortunate as to be a human with consciousness in an amazing time of advancement in our understanding of the universe?

    As for your question about hope, I can only assume that you are talking about hope for living eternally (i.e. going to heaven). Science is, everyday, demonstrating that there is no separation between the mind/soul and our brains. When we and our brains die, we die – that’s it. There is no more. Therefore, any hope I live with focuses on science/medicine’s ability to keep me alive and healthy for a long, long time. I don’t expect to live forever – although I fully expect there will come a day (maybe 100 or 1000 years in the future) when humans will live hundreds – perhaps thousands of years.

    I also have hope that our world – humanity – will learn to treat one another better and that we will learn to treat the earth better. There are many other things I am hopeful for, but those few things are a good start and, please notice that this hope has nothing to do with some god intervening to save us from our mortality.

    Anyways, can you tell me why the awesome order that surrounds us is NOT evidence FOR God?

    This is also known as the argument from design. It’s an old argument that, in my opinion, has been shown to have little merit. Our world evolved just as life evolved. Evolution is a process that creates order out of chaos in incremental steps over millions and billions of years. If you are at the tail end of that process, everything will seem amazingly suitable to your existence. That’s because you are the end result of billions of failed attempts. Put another way, a fish out of water doesn’t survive and his live in the ocean is a perfect fit for it. I’ve said this very poorly. For much better explanations, please google ‘argument from design’ or critical analysis of ‘intelligent design’. Also, you may want to investigate the critique of ‘irreducible complexity’. All are good starting points for exploring your question more fully.

    And aren’t your arguments against a big “g” God that exists, not the piddly little “g” god that’s a fake? Are you only making it worse for yourself by referring to “god” if God exists?

    I am still sensing that you fear reprisal. I am not afraid of reprisal due to what I think you see as disrespect because I simply do not think god(s) exist. Giving god the name “God” assigns him/her/it a personality – something I do not think a non-existent thing should have.

    Thanks for your questions. :)

  20. 40 Year Old Atheist on July 21st, 2009 at 6:48 pm

    Hi DDD,
    A little swamped at the moment. I will post a response in the next day or two. Thanks.

  21. Michael R on July 26th, 2009 at 10:47 pm

    “can you logically prove there is no god?”

    Classic. Also nonsense. You can’t prove there’s not a purple frog with tits running the whole universe, either. Is that a good reason to believe in this frog? Nope. End argument.

  22. DDD on August 7th, 2009 at 4:33 pm

      Whew! Lots of info there. I’ll look into all that in the coming weeks.
      My comments at the end related to little “g” god/big “G” God are simply meant to inject a little (questionable) humor into a very serious conversation.
      For some reason, we (myself included, I think) sometimes seem to get all uptight and confrontational when telling others about what we believe, and I appreciate the fact that you haven’t talked down to me here, like Michael R seemed to do. Let’s not get crazy, right? This is important stuff. Let’s keep the discussion going…

  23. Martin Willett on August 13th, 2009 at 2:08 am

    Nothing follows from atheism. It is in the interests of believers to imply that all atheists… but nothing is true of all atheists. It is a poor tactic in the Big Debate to imply that there are bad consequences of holding or rejecting a particular belief because that’s not how beliefs work. Nobody says to themselves that it would be bad to believe that E=MC2 or that the combustion of carbon and sulphur using potassium nitrate as an oxidant causes a very rapid expansion of gases. No matter what the consequences of something being true are it is either true or it isn’t. Hoping for good consequences cannot change any facts. The existence or non-existence of gods is a fact and no more open to judging by its consequences than any other fact.
    Making out that morality and decency have something to do with myths being true is an extremely bad idea, when those myths are shown not to be true some people may actually believe that there is no reason to obey laws, get married, love people, care about other people or behave decently. The believers paint us as monsters and they want us to be monsters so that we serve as bad examples for their children. Sod that.

  24. lnfinity on September 25th, 2009 at 10:07 pm

    I agree with all of your post and your conclusion, but I feel you have included one unnecessary word, which limits the scope of the implications of the conclusions you so elegantly derive.  That one word is human. 

    “we think every human deserves to have what we have.”

    Well, why only humans?  We are brought up to take this for granted, but why should only other humans have their desires considered?  Why not every other being capable of possessing desires?

    Richard Dawkins does an excellent job of making this point in his essay Gaps in the mind, and I hope more atheists would break free of our religiously-inspired human-centric morals and truly show the world how much MORE moral we are!

    Gaps in the Mind:

    http://www.simonyi.ox.ac.uk/dawkins/WorldOfDawkins-archive/Dawkins/Work/Articles/1993gaps_in_the_mind.shtml

  25. RBAth on October 21st, 2009 at 1:41 am

    Nice article, and some nice debating going on in the comments thread; I’ve never seen dialogue between a Christian and an atheist to be so cordial on an athesit blog! I think I’m going to steal some of these examples, because I always get stuck in conversations with people aout faith (debating has never been a strong point of mine).
    I’m not sure I like the idea that we ought to be ‘grateful’ to someone or something; the word implies to me that we were chosen to be here. I think luck is a better word to use in the context.

  26. hendoc on October 26th, 2009 at 3:38 pm

    I’m 60 years young and the wonders of the the natural  universe hold me in awe more each day with the new emerging technologies. I’m not trying to inflame any christians, but I feel sorry for them.
     

  27. OuweRot on October 27th, 2009 at 6:44 am

    Nice post.
    I’m calling myself an atheïst, but I hate to being placed in “the group of atheïsts”. Everyone is responsible for him/herself and his/her own deeds. You cannot group people up in a group like ‘Not believing in a god’ and expect they all have the same morals and values.
    I like the friendly discussion here going on in the comments!

  28. Jay FItz on October 29th, 2009 at 3:40 pm

    Nice post, I agree.
    One thing worth considering, however, is another correlary to your argument–a position I’ve considered  and advocated a thoughful form of  “militant atheism”  for years–the observation that in the vast majority of cases, not only there is there no evidence for God, there’s very very very little, if any, evidence that any “christians” believe the crap they spout off. In short, my position is that “I don’t believe, neither do I believe that they do either.” If anything, it seems that modern christians(in particular) have values and behave in a fashion that in no way whatsoever resembles the kind of lifestyle that one might postulate as “reflective” of a bona fide belief in god. As such, I assume that these people are scamers and fakes, using the trapestry of a belief system wholly for self-serving personal gain. I think it would be good to start calling these people out.  Some people are religious because they’re “retarded”–actually a very deliberate word choice here–but most are religious because they’re liars.

  29. Renshia on October 30th, 2009 at 12:44 am

    I assume that these people are scamers and fakes, using the trapestry of a belief system wholly for self-serving personal gain. I think it would be good to start calling these people out.  Some people are religious because they’re “retarded”–actually a very deliberate word choice here–but most are religious because they’re liars.

     
    AMEN

  30. Nick on October 30th, 2009 at 5:22 am

    Some may be “retarded”, lots may be are  liars or cynics , but I think most Christians (and possibly other religious followers too but I dont have so much contact) just believe because they are told to and supposed to and dont really even think about it.
    Their Christianity is just a label they dont work towards or against, a bit like nationality.  Most of the christians I know just go through the motions, without questioning or even understanding. A kind of apathetic christianity that they do because it is expected, … by Granny, by teacher, by neighbour etc…
    I don’t see the majority as scammers and fakes, more sheep-like and gullible.  But I do totally agree with you that they should still be called out on it and made to question why they believe, why they encourage their kids to believe etc.

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